Frank and Stan Chats

By: Frank Norris and Stan Johnson
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  • Summary

  • Frank Norris and Stan Johnson have been friends since 1995. Both have had successful and lengthy careers in education. Frank was a very senior HMI with Ofsted for 11 years and was the CEO of the Coop Academies Trust for 6 years. Stan was seconded to Ofsted for a year and then returned to headship before working as a senior adviser with Lancashire LA. He has latterly led a successful education consultancy in the North West. Prior to Covid-19, the two gents would meet in Manchester for a pint or two but the pandemic put an end to that. On 1 May 2020, they recorded their first video chat as a way of recording their emotions and reactions to the pandemic. After putting the video on Youtube as a safe place to store it they realised that some followers began to appear. Now, with nearly 180 episodes and having chatted to Professors, CEOs, journalists, teachers, former HMI, education thinkers and Frank's Key Stage 1 leading daughter they have a loyal following and a rapidly increasing number of viewers. The reach of the Frank and Stan Chat stretches from Bogota to Ottawa to Greece and their first Live Edition was recorded in front of nearly 200 Headteachers in York. The Chats are not undertaken to attract followers or for financial reward (nothing is received and nothing will be received). It is a way of airing views on education matters between two professional friends with a focus on leadership. We are honoured to be invited to host the weekly chats on the Leader-connect website www.leader-connect.co.uk. The chats helped the gents get through the pandemic and they are delighted that they have been enjoyed by others and appear to have helped in developing leadership thought and actions. If you fancy being a guest then just reach out. We never post a video unless the guest is comfortable with it. So, it is a relatively risk-free environment. Thank you. Frank and Stan

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    © 2023 Frank and Stan Chats
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Episodes
  • Frank and Stan Chat No. 198

    Frank and Stan Chat No. 198
    Sep 20 2024

    We've always been interested in chatting with teachers who have undertaken research into areas we have not chatted about. This week Caroline Popplewell, a Primary School teacher from the North West joins the gents to discuss her school based Masters research into the introduction of the Eco-School programme. She explains the challenges she faced in balancing her other school commitments but ultimately was pleased to see such a positive response from the children. We then considered how best to spread the practice so that more children could benefit.


    Stan reflected on some of the leadership issues that have appeared within the new government and whether they could or should have been avoided. We shifted these issues into school scenarios where it is relatively easy to be conflicted through receiving a small gift or a favour. Caroline then praises the efforts of a local business that supplied fans of Morecambe FC ear defenders and spinning widgets for those that might be anxious about the noise and hustle and bustle during the game. Frank then reflects on a wonderful session provided by Everton Nursery at a major Liverpool Education conference today. The emphasis was on the meaning of education and it aligned so neatly with many of our videocast and podcast chats. An uplifting and positive experience.


    Highly enjoyable chatting with Caroline and we hope you gain some important insights and areas to reflect upon to improve your teaching and leadership. If that's the case (or not) then please let us know.


    Until next week when we are joined by Chelsea Slater, CEO and joint Founder of InnovateHer.


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    39 mins
  • Frank and Stan Chat No. 197

    Frank and Stan Chat No. 197
    Sep 13 2024

    This week the gents are delighted to welcome Prof Mel Ainscow back as a guest. Mel is Emeritus Professor of Education, and an internationally recognized authority on the promotion of inclusion and equity in education. Previously a head teacher, local education authority adviser and lecturer at the University of Cambridge, he's also a long-term consultant to UNESCO. He

    led the Greater Manchester Challenge a three-year project that involved a partnership between national government, ten local authorities, 1,150 schools and many other stakeholders, and had a government investment of around £50 million. He went on to lead Schools Challenge Cymru, the Welsh Government’s multi-million pound flagship programme to accelerate the rate of improvement across the country’s schools. He is currently steering an inclusive cross schools project for the city of Dundee.


    Mel has a new book out called 'Developing Inclusive Schools' and this dominates, in a pleasant way, the discussion. We dropped the usual 'what's caught your eye this week?' slot due to the genuine interest in Mel's contribution to the discussion. It is a wide ranging chat but offers hope for a better future if local, regional and national leaders are willing to grasp the nettle.


    Sit back and enjoy what Mel has to say. It will probably change your view on SEND, behaviour, attendance, culture and collaboration.


    Enjoy.


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    42 mins
  • Frank and Stan Chat No. 196

    Frank and Stan Chat No. 196
    Sep 7 2024
    The two gents are back for another academic year. The seven week break they have had has recharged the batteries and much has happened in education, especially in the past week. Fortuitously, they are joined by John Malynn, a long serving senior Civil Servant at the DfE and for four years at Ofsted. Frank and John would meet regularly to discuss developments such as new Frameworks when Frank was responsible for such matters as a senior HMI. The publication of the Big Listen including the report from Dame Christine Gilbert this week means that John has a rather unique perspective on such issues. Stan reflects on the announcement but lack of detail on how regional school improvement teams will work. John then considers the insight provided by Rory Stewart in his book 'Politics on the Edge' with Frank trying to get out of his Ofsted 'rabbit hole' by considering how realistic is the timetable for a new inspection framework with surrounding other issues to be delivered by September 2025. It is a fascinating insight into how the relationship between Ofsted and the DfE has changed over time and how important it is to get the next phase of development right.

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    47 mins
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