In part two of their series on apprenticeships, Jeff talks with Claire Fiddian-Green, president and CEO of the Richard M. Fairbanks Foundation, about Indiana’s ambitious efforts to adapt lessons from Switzerland’s gold-standard model. They explore how Indiana is transforming high school graduation requirements, building industry-led talent associations, and designing scalable pathways that center real-world work experience. The conversation covers the challenges of shifting culture, coordinating stakeholders, and ensuring permeability between career and college tracks—all with the goal of making apprenticeships a respected and rigorous route to success after high school. This episode is made with support from Ascendium Education Group and the Gates Foundation.

“No Time to Lose: How to Build a World-Class Education System State by State,” - The National Council of State Legislatures

Apprentice Nation: How the "Earn and Learn" Alternative to Higher Education Will Create a Stronger and Fairer America, - Ryan Craig

“Career and Technical Education for All,” - Daniel Curtis and Michael B. Horn

0:00 - Intro
3:32 - Focusing Indiana on CTE
5:00 - Applying Lessons Learned from Swiss Apprenticeship in Indiana
8:05 - Building an Apprenticeship System at Scale
10:58 - Adjusting Graduation Requirements
13:52 - The Keys to Successful Stakeholder Collaboration in Indiana
15:10 - Centering Permeability
19:05 - States in the Lead on Apprenticeship
21:56 - Putting Employers in the Driver’s Seat
26:30 - Carving Out Apprenticeship Pathways in High Schools
31:30 - Bringing it Back to the Why

Jeff and Michael are joined by Mushtaq Gunja, Executive Director of the Carnegie Classification Systems and Senior Vice President at ACE, to unpack the sweeping changes to the Carnegie Classifications. They explore how the new system aims to better group institutions, highlight student access and earnings, and shift incentives across funding, accountability, and rankings. The conversation dives into the implications for colleges chasing R1 status, the normative power of classifications, and whether these changes will meaningfully alter institutional behavior or simply create a new hierarchy. This episode is made with support from Ascendium Education Group and the Gates Foundation.

2025 Institutional Classifications, Carnegie Classifications of Institutions of Higher Education

2025 Research Activity Designations, Carnegie Classifications of Institutions of Higher Education

0:00 - Intro
05:50 - The Changing Higher Ed Landscape
08:06 - The Impact of the New Classifications
10:42 - Anticipating the Normative Effects
16:55 - New Funding Criteria
18:13 - Shifting to a Focus on Outcomes
21:17 - Measuring Access and Earnings
24:53 - Encouraging Good Use of the New Classifications
34:24 - Considering the Impact on Research Dollars
40:28 - Institutional Response to Access and Earnings Designations
46:30 - What This Means for Rankings

As colleges navigate increasing financial pressure, many struggle to balance mission with sustainability. In this episode, Jeff and Michael welcome Rick Staisloff, founder of rpk GROUP, for a crash course in how college budgets really work. From centralized vs. decentralized models to the challenges of tuition discounting, Rick breaks down the major drivers of revenue and expense in higher ed. He also highlights why better business intelligence, clearer accountability, and a shift toward ROI thinking are essential for financial sustainability. Whether you're a board member or just curious, this episode offers practical insight into what’s working—and what’s not—in college budgeting. This episode is made with support from Ascendium Education Group and the Gates Foundation.

Chapters

0:00 - Intro

03:45 - How colleges put together their budgets

9:05 - Implementation challenges and best practices

15:04 - Non-tuition revenue sources

26:21 - Cost drivers

29:41 - Solving the “Financial Bucket Problem”

35:41 - Deferred maintenance

38:11 - Shifting to an ROI mindset

41:04 - The levers to pull

43:14 - On the margins

46:44 - College cash sources

49:03 - Our most promising strategies

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