Digitalization promised us a brave “new work” world. But instead we ended up with more meetings and “fake work”. What’s next and how do we transform our obsession with productivity tools and endless meetings into meaningful work and real innovation?

In this episode of Poets & Thinkers, we explore the future of work with Markus Albers, a Berlin-based journalist, author, and entrepreneur whose insights have consistently anticipated major shifts in how we work. From his prescient 2008 book predicting remote work to his latest exploration of “the optimization lie,” Markus reveals how our relationship with work has evolved – and why the promised freedom of digital tools has instead chained us to our screens.

Markus takes us on a journey through the changing landscape of work, explaining how the initial promise of technology to free us from our desks has instead created an “always on” culture where work seeps into every aspect of our lives. He shares alarming research showing knowledge workers now spend 60% of their time in meetings and collaboration rather than doing creative work – and how this leads to widespread dissatisfaction and disengagement. And the effects on innovation in businesses around the world are fatal. Yet through his research with companies like Bayer, he also uncovers promising models for a more fluid, fulfilling future of work powered by AI and skill-based platforms.

Throughout our conversation, Markus challenges conventional management approaches that prioritize control over creation, arguing that leaders need to rediscover their own creative capacities and build organizations where people can actually finish their days feeling they’ve accomplished something meaningful. His vision for the future of work emphasizes fluidity, cross-organizational collaboration, and technology that serves human needs rather than extracting maximum productivity.

In this inspiring discussion, we explore:

• Why the initial promise of technology to make us more productive and happier hasn’t materialized
• How managers’ fear of losing control has led to calendar overload and measurement obsession
• The identity crisis facing managers as AI threatens to replace routine work
• What organizations like Bayer are doing to create more fluid, skill-based work models
• How leaders can fight for freedom from constant work in an AI-powered future

This episode is an invitation to reimagine our relationship with work—to move beyond optimization for its own sake and create environments where people can truly create, ship, and find fulfillment.

Topics

02:30 - Markus’s journey from journalist to author and entrepreneur

04:00 - The Meconomy book and its early vision of the digital revolution

07:30 - The evolution of the "future of work" from liberation to digital exhaustion

09:10 - How we freed ourselves from desk chains but chained ourselves to screens instead

11:30 - Leaders’ fear of losing control in hybrid work environments

12:30 - The need to rediscover our capacity to create and ship meaningful work

14:30 - Microsoft research showing knowledge workers spend 60% of time on collaboration

16:00 - The leadership challenge of reconfiguring how work is done

17:00 - The importance of asynchronous communication skills for leaders

18:40 - The growing debate about “bullshit jobs” and management bureaucracy

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What if the key to navigating our AI-driven future isn’t about becoming more technological, but rather more authentically human? In this inspiring episode of Poets & Thinkers, we explore the intersection of technology, leadership, and human dignity with Frances West, a pioneering executive whose wisdom spans decades of technological transformation. As IBM’s first-ever Chief Accessibility Officer and a global advocate for digital inclusion, Frances brings a unique perspective on how to harness AI’s potential while keeping humanity at the center.

Frances takes us on a journey through her remarkable career, from arriving in America at age 19 to becoming a trailblazing technology executive who helped shape IBM’s approach to human-centered innovation. Drawing on insights from her book “Authentic Inclusion™ Drives Disruptive Innovation,” she reveals why the skills we’ve traditionally considered “soft” – creativity, empathy, persistence, and ethical judgment – will become our most valuable assets in an AI-driven world.

Throughout our conversation, Frances challenges the dominant narratives around AI, arguing that as artificial intelligence becomes more advanced, humans must embrace and cultivate the qualities that make us uniquely human. She offers a compelling vision for business leadership that balances profit with principle and purpose, emphasizing that true innovation must be rooted in meeting authentic human needs rather than merely advancing technology for its own sake.

In this thought-provoking discussion, we explore:

• Why “human first” thinking is crucial for ethical technology development
• How digital inclusion benefits everyone, not just those with disabilities
• The leadership traits essential for navigating our AI-integrated future
• Why “popcorn innovation” fails where disciplined vision succeeds
• The balance between maintaining our authentic selves while embracing AI tools

This episode is an invitation to reimagine our relationship with technology through a lens of authentic inclusion, challenging us to develop the leadership qualities that will help humanity thrive alongside artificial intelligence.

Topics

00:30 - Introduction to Frances West and her career at IBM

03:30 - The concept of “human first” in technology development

06:00 - Balancing AI advancement with human dignity and agency

13:30 - The importance of building inclusive technology from the start

17:40 - How technology has evolved from mainframes to personalized devices

21:10 - The human qualities AI cannot easily replicate

27:10 - "As AI gets more human, humans need to get more human"

30:40 - Balancing foundational skills with creativity in education

34:00 - The evolution of leadership skills needed for an AI-integrated world

36:00 - The Four L’s of leadership: Listen, Learn, Lived experience, Lead

41:30 - Avoiding "popcorn innovation" with disciplined vision and execution

45:30 - How sales experience grounds technological innovation

50:40 - Frances’s vision for the future of business leadership

52:00 - The Five C’s for future leaders: Confidence, Conviction, Communication, Curiosity, and Courage

Resources Mentioned

Authentic Inclusion™ Drives Disruptive Innovation by Frances Wes

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Get in touch: ben@poetsandthinkers.co

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Subscribe to Poets & Thinkers on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/poets-thinkers/id1799627484

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What if our fixation on avoiding failure is the very thing blocking us from building organizations that maximize human ingenuity? And why is this business critical in the AI age?

In this episode of Poets & Thinkers, we explore the intersection of leadership, innovation, and human potential with John Danner, renowned business advisor, professor, and bestselling author. Drawing on his extensive experience teaching at UC Berkeley and Princeton while advising leaders across sectors, John challenges conventional wisdom about what drives organizational success in our rapidly evolving AI-everything world.

John takes us on a journey through what he calls the three fundamental organizational pursuits – growth, innovation, and engagement – and reveals why they all depend on the one thing leaders often fear most: failure. He explains why the status quo serves as the greatest obstacle to progress and how our natural human bias toward familiarity creates resistance to change. Through compelling insights and personal anecdotes from decades of personal experience, John illuminates how fear silences organizational creativity while analyzing startling Gallup research showing only 20% of employees globally are truly engaged in their work.

As we navigate the profound transformation brought by AI and other technologies, John presents a critical fork in the road: organizations can pursue "AI to the max" with minimal human input, or they can embrace a more humanistic model built on human ingenuity, imagination, and collaboration. His vision for “invitational leadership” offers a compelling alternative to extractive models that have dominated business thinking for generations.

In this discussion, we explore:

• Why failure is the unavoidable companion to genuine growth and innovation
• How fear serves as the “border patrol” for the status quo in organizations
• The alarming reality that only one in five employees globally is engaged at work
• The third revolutionary period we’re entering: the inclusion challenge
• Why leaders must shift from extraction to resourcefulness in building sustainable organizations
• The power of “invitational leadership” in unleashing human creativity at all levels

This episode is an invitation to reimagine leadership for a more human-centered future, challenging us to develop organizational cultures where everyone – not just an elite few – can contribute their inherent creativity and imagination.

Topics

03:10 - The three fundamentals every organization strives for: growth, innovation, and engagement

04:20 - How growth, innovation, and engagement all depend on failure

06:30 - The status quo as the primary obstacle to change and improvement

08:50 - The interconnection between fear, feedback, and failure in organizational culture

12:00 - Leaders acknowledging their own fallibility to create psychological safety

13:10 - Gallup research on employee engagement: only 20% engaged, 15% actively disengaged

15:10 - The concept of “growth for both” – aligning organizational and individual growth

17:30 - The three revolutionary periods: industrial, information, and now the inclusion challenge

21:00 - Two possible futures: “AI to the max” versus human ingenuity and imagination

26:00 - Challenging extractive business models in favor of resourcefulness

28:10 - Shifting from “l

Send us a text

Get in touch: ben@poetsandthinkers.co

Follow us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/poetsandthinkerspodcast/

Subscribe to Poets & Thinkers on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/poets-thinkers/id1799627484

Subscribe to Poets & Thinkers on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4N4jnNEJraemvlHIyUZdww?si=2195345fa6d249fd