In this episode, the Convocation Unscripted team takes a break from the daily outrages coming from the Trump administration to talk about the work for racial justice, healing, and repair that is taking place in unexpected places. Jemar talked about his recent travels to Jackson, Mississippi, and Montgomery and Selma, Alabama. Robby talked about his recent trips to speak at First Baptist Church of Richmond, Virginia, where his book White Too Long was chosen as a city-side book read for Black History Month, and to the Zacchaeus Foundation in Little Rock, Arkansas, which is facilitating reparations payments from white residents and historically white churches to support Black nonprofits in Northwest Arkansas. Diana is also about to be on the road for much of April, speaking with churches and groups who are continuing the work of social and racial justice, even against the prevailing winds. We wrapped the episode with a tribute to Roger Freet, a literary agent to and friend of Diana and Robby, who passed away this week. He was a great soul who supported so much good work in the world, and we miss him.

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Amid the continued onslaught against our Constitutional rights by the Trump administration, Robby, Kristin, and Diana discuss the importance of focusing on “bright lines” that are being crossed. We celebrate the institutions that continue to hold courageous conversations in these challenging days, such as First Baptist Church of Richmond and St. Mary’s College in Indiana, which are hosting Robby and Kristin for public conversations. We discuss the likely illegal detaining of Mahmoud Khalil--a Palestinian recent graduate of Columbia University, U.S. green card holder, and husband of an American citizen—for speech the Trump administration did not like. We also talk about the dangers of Trump’s usurpation of power by declaring a national emergency. This emergency declaration, made without any legitimate grounds, gives Trump the power to unilaterally impose tariffs and to invoke the Alien Enemies Act, as he is likely to do shortly to institute mass deportations.

Finally we talk about the heresy circulating in Christian circles that empathy is a threat to the gospel. We point out that previous purges of empathy as a Christian virtue among white Christians in America prepared the ground for the genocide of Indigenous people and the enslavement of people of African descent. We know where that road leads. We also discussed the importance of universities and churches to avoid the trap of neutrality, since, as our colleague Jemar always reminds us, justice takes sides.

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Robert P. Jones- www.whitetoolong.net

Diana Butler Bass- dianabutlerbass.substack.com

Kristin Du Mez- kristindumez.substack.com

Jemar Tisby- JemarTisby.Substack.com