Spirituality, religion, and being “woo-woo” are all hot topics these days – especially here in Nashville!

In this episode, Val and Emerson tackle WTF spirituality actually means, how it differs from religion, how it intertwines with existentialism, and low-stakes ways to engage with it while also avoiding spiritual bypassing.

And, as always, we get into other good stuff, including a spooky airBNB story from Val’s cousin (and The Gaia Center’s Director of Operations) Rebecca 👻

This episode covers:

• 06:04 - Tea & Crumpets: Val’s new cooking routine + Emerson’s obsession with Swig
• 10:32 - Step Into My Office: Impermanence and Existentialism
• 14:32 - The Lore: Rebecca’s Spooky AirBNB experience
• 19:54 - The DSM: The Spirituality, Religion + Woo Woo Conundrum
• 50:26 - Now That's What I Call...OKAAAAY!
• 52:48 - Val Pick: "Goose Snow Cone" by Aimee Mann
• 53:50 - "Older" by Lizzy McAlpine
• 54:58 - Fire Dumpster Phoenix: How a music conductor is navigating Parkinson’s Disease + South Africa’s ‘soccer grannies’ take the field for kicks and camaraderie

Resources + Stuff Mentioned in This Episode:

• Pew Research on Millennials and Religion
• John Welwood (spiritual bypassing)
• Goose Snow Cone by Aimee Mann
• Older by Lizzy McAlpine
• Conductor with Parkinson’s Gets Brain Stimulation Device to Stop Shakes so He Can Lead Orchestra Once Again
• South Africa’s ‘soccer grannies’ take the field for kicks and camaraderie

Connect with Us:

• Send a story or ask for advice: butforrealpod@gmail.com
• But For Real on IG: @butforrealpod
• Now That's What I Call... OKAAAAY Playlist
• The Gaia Center on IG: @thegaiacenter
• Val on IG: @valkaymartin
• The Gaia Center website: www.gaiacenter.co

DISCLAIMER: But For Real Podcast is not a substitute for individualized mental health treatment or healthcare. This podcast is solely for entertainment and educational purposes. If you are in crisis, please utilize crisis support services, such as the Crisis Text Line (Text START to 741741 in the US) or the 988 Suicide & Crisis Lifeline: (Call 988 in the US), or visit www.findahelpline.com for international resources.

For many people, hearing “couples therapy” brings up the idea of a relationship being in crisis or on the brink of ending – and while couples therapy can be impactful in those cases, there is so much more to it and so many other circumstances where it can be beneficial. In this episode, Valerie and Emerson get into what couples therapy really is, when it’s helpful, when it’s not helpful, and suggestions for what to look for if you’re interested in couples therapy.

This episode covers:

• 00:03:23 - Tea & Crumpets: Zumba at the YMCA + Harmen Hoek
• 00:06:53 - The Lore: How Couples Therapy Helped Val
• 00:14:46 - The DSM: What Couples Therapy Really Is
• 00:53:20 - Now That's What I Call...OKAAAAY!
• 00:55:27 - Em Pick: "A Thousand Trees" by Stereophonics
• 00:57:13 - Val Pick: "In Keeping Secrets of Earth: 3" by Coheed & Cambria
• 00:58:31 - Fire Dumpster Phoenix: How Massachusetts became the only state to reduce food waste + how a 90 year old woman has saved over 10,000 animals

Resources + Stuff Mentioned in This Episode:

• Harmen Hoek
• A Thousand Trees- by Stereophonics
• In Keeping Secrets of Silent Earth: 3 - by Coheed and Cambria
• Waste not, want not? How Massachusetts became the only state to reduce food waste
• 90 year old woman has saved over 10,000 animals
• Gottman Method
• Emotion Focused Therapy
• Imago
• RLT
• PACT

Connect with Us:

• Send a story or ask for advice: butforrealpod@gmail.com
• But For Real on IG: @butforrealpod
• Now That's What I Call... OKAAAAY Playlist
• The Gaia Center on IG: @thegaiacenter
• Val on IG: @valkaymartin
• The Gaia Center website: www.gaiacenter.co

DISCLAIMER: But For Real Podcast is not a substitute for individualized mental health treatment or healthcare. This podcast is solely for entertainment and educational purposes. If you are in crisis, please utilize crisis support services, such as the Crisis Text Line (Text START to 741741 in the US) or the 988 Suicide & Crisis Lifeline: (Call 988 in the US), or visit

Despite misinformed pop culture statements, OCD isn’t a punchline—it’s a chronic brain loop that can be incredibly challenging for individuals to receive the care they need. In this episode, Val and Em get into the ins-and-outs of OCD, including suggestions for folks who are struggling with it, as well as folks who have a friend or loved one who is struggling. And, as always, we get into plenty of other fun stuff including TV recs and some hopeful headlines – like a rancher’s dog rescuing an infant 🥹

This episode covers:

• 04:40 - Tea & Crumpets: The Last of Us + Good American Family
• 08:07 - Step Into My Office: Is it just overthinking or is it OCD?
• 12:53 - The DSM: Why OCD Is NOT Just Being “So Organized”
• 36:37 - Now That's What I Call...OKAAAAY!
• 40:50 - Val’s Pick: "Leave" by Glen Hansard (Live at Stubb's BBQ)
• 43:50 - Em’s Pick: "twilight zone" by Ariana Grande
• 45:56 - Fire Dumpster Phoenix: Hundreds of volunteers helping an indie bookseller move spaces + a rancher’s dog leading an infant to safety

Resources + Stuff Mentioned in This Episode:

• Long durations from symptom onset to diagnosis and from diagnosis to treatment in obsessive-compulsive disorder: A retrospective self-report study
• Thriving in Relationships When You Have OCD book
• Hundreds of Volunteers Form a Human Chain to Get 9,000 Books to New Location for Indie Bookstore
• A true good boy: rancher’s dog leads two-year-old Arizona child to safety
• Glen Hansard "Leave" - Live at Stubb's BBQ
• "twilight zone" by Ariana Grande

Connect with Us:

• Send a story or ask for advice: butforrealpod@gmail.com
• But For Real on IG: @butforrealpod
• Now That's What I Call... OKAAAAY Playlist
• The Gaia Center on IG: @thegaiacenter
• Val on IG: